Regarding how Palin would juggle the responsibilities of being the VP with her family life, Jack wrote:
"It is true that the media did not ask the same questions of Obama, Biden or McCain. The thing that complicates the issue further is that the media did not have to ask Obama or Biden about how they will balance their home lives. Both Obama and Biden freely offered this information in full during the course of their campaign. Palin has not had the opportunity to do so as her pick was sudden and surprising."
Jack goes on to discuss why he believes it's a legitimate question and I don't disagree with him on that point. He also praised Obama's handling of the issue of Palin's daughter being thrown into the fray. Well, okay, but I remember a time when I was much more partisan than I am today. I remember people on the other side of the political divide not letting the Bush campaign off the hook for things said by other people in the party, people who were not part of the campaign. Those people, the very people who wanted to hold Bush and/or his campaign directly responsible for say, the Swift Boat Veterans for the Truth's campaign against Kerry, are most likely the very rabid, political animals who are engaged in the attempted character assassination of Sarah Palin. I say this just to make the point that there are people who, from their own partisan positions, will not accept that this isn't a direct part of the Obama "machine." If it was fair for the far left to claim Swift Boat Vets were part of the Bush political machine then, they may have to take a dose of their own medicine.
And, rest assured, I'm not directing this at my good Democrat friends, I actually have some and it's doubtful, to me, they'd be rooting for the continuance of this attempted character assassination of Palin.
Obama shouldn't be held accountable for everything everyone who supports him writes or says about his political opponent(s) anymore than I believed Bush should have been held accountable for everything everyone who supported him ever wrote or said about his political opponent(s).
What I appreciated about Jack's post and where I think this issue is the most saddening is when he wrote the above quoted segment. No one had "to ask Obama or Biden about how they will balance their home lives. Both Obama and Biden freely offered this information in full during the course of their campaign. Palin has not had the opportunity to do so as her pick was sudden and surprising."
Palin didn't have the chance, the vultures descended on her without giving her the opportunity to offer that information freely and voluntarily, as the other candidates have been able to do, and I think I've even heard that some people are proposing that she is unwilling to give that information, when the reality is, she just hasn't had the chance yet.
Certainly, Republicans have every right to complain. Michelle Malkin is doing a bit of complaining today. In Us magazine’s partisan hit job, Malkin pointed out a US magazine headline read: "John McCain's Vice President SARAH PALIN: BABIES, LIES & SCANDAL."
Malkin reminds readers of the June cover of US magazine on Barack Obama: "Michelle Obama, Why Barack Loves Her," further, on the cover, "She shops at Target, loved Sex and the City and never misses the girls' recitals. The untold romance between a down-to-earth mom and the man who calls her 'my rock'"
Precious.
Jason Wert of Life Of Jason, brought up the John Roberts question about Palin's ability to be VP and devote an appropriate amount of time to her special needs child, here. I thought at the time, the level of outrage was a bit over the top but, hmmm, maybe not. I had no idea the media firestorm that was waiting in the wings for Sarah Palin. It would have been nice, as Andy Cline pointed out, if Roberts had asked Palin rather than another reporter the question. Cline agreed, there was a legitimate question that could have been asked of Palin, well, rather than summarize what he wrote, here it is:
"Roberts and Bash are engaging in a practice typical of political reporting on TV today--a practice I object to: reporters talking to each other about issues as if they are experts. They should be reporting news, not engaging each other in speculation.
There is a legitimate question here that ought to be asked of the candidate. I would phrase it this way: What challenges does raising a special needs child present for a vice president?
Palin needs to be ready to respond to this reasonable question. What's unreasonable about the Roberts/Bash conversation is the underlying premise that one might not be able to handle both jobs well."
Certainly, it has provided more fodder for conservatives to declare there is a liberal bias in the media. Andy?
28 comments:
As I stated pretty clearly on my blog, this Daily Kos member considers Governor Palin's family and family life completely off limits. Although I wonder how many of the people now complaining about the hateful bilge published in US magazine also complained about the hateful anti-Democrat bilge the Rush Limbaughs and Matt Drudges of the media have been pumping out on a regular basis for years.
Governor Palin's professional life and qualifications for the Vice-Presidency - now that's completely different. I look forward to hearing Governor Palin talk about herself and her record in her own words.
I'm glad you weighed in.
I think it's legitimate that you wonder about "hateful bilge" on the right. I've purposely chosen to insulate myself from it, somewhat. You are probably more sensitive to it coming from the right and I'm probably more sensitive to it coming from the left. That's only natural, don't you think?
I have to practically get hit over the head with this kind of stuff to take much note of it anymore. I view all of it as a waste of time, pretty much. A person could spend 24 hours a day fussing over that junk if they wanted, at some point it just doesn't seem worth the trouble.
The character assassination on Palin met that "hit over the head" standard this week. It really couldn't be avoided.
I suspect we're both due for a season of getting hit over the head now, huh? ;)
Walloped over the head is more like it. My wife - a Political Science minor back in the day - has always loved this kind of stuff. I just want it to be over.
I didn't watch Governor Palin's speech because I had to work out. My beloved wife did, and was impressed with her presentation. To judge from your comments and Jason's, she certainly hit a grand slam with the conservative base. If she does equally well outside of the convention hall, she could be a true difference maker.
Still, I believe Governor Palin has a lot to explain about her record and qualifications. She showed last night that (like Senator Biden) she is no slouch at turning up the heat on the opposition. Let's see if she can take the heat too.
And how did you feel about the "hot chick" buttons last night? That is sexist too. She is more than an attractive trophy "wife" of McCain. So now the RNC members are being sexist toward her.
Women can't catch a break.
"Women can't catch a break."
In some ways, yeah.
I still think people are too sensitive sometimes and political correctness has gone too far, though.
:)
I think a better case can be made for Roberts' question being sexist rather than leftist.
Andy,
Probably so, in the case of Roberts, but what about the other instances?
I believe it can be said that how one approaches there family life, is how one will also govern.
With a 17 year old already 5 months pregnant I'm not to sure of the parenting skills of this lady or her husband. Granted they have wallowed up to the accept some responsibility but it leads me to question whether or not she will govern as bad as she governed her household.
Bristol Palin didn't just up and decide to sleep with this guy overnight there were much more other factors that went into this decision and much of it revolves around how she was raised.
You may disagree with me but I wouldn't hire and individual to be a CEO if he/she had filed for personal bankruptcy, I also don't want the number 2 in the nation not being able to keep tabs on her own family. And YES the husband has just as much blame as Sarah as does the daughter. She made a terrible decision and this is one that her parents should have prevented at all cost. I hate to say it but normally these types of marriages are doomed to failure.
Tom, I understand your perspective but I don't agree with it.
Parents all across the nation do the best they can by their children every day, not every parent but certainly many. What causes one to become a doctor, lawyer, teacher or president, and the other to get involved with drugs or any other pitfall that awaits them in life?
I think it's absolutely fantastic and wonderful that you and your wife have been blessed with wonderful children who have never gotten into trouble. It IS a blessing for which you should be very thankful.
I also feel I can say without even expressing it as "opinion" that other parents have worked just as hard as you and your wife to raise, educate and rear solid, good, adult children but, through no fault of their own, their children exercised their own free will and did things they knew were wrong and against the wishes of their parents.
Some of those children ended up pregnant. Some ended up addicted to drugs. Some didn't take advantage of opportunities for higher education, choosing to fritter their time away in social activities rather than in learning the most they could when they had the opportunity.
Really, I wish everyone could be as blessed as your family. Life just isn't that way and personal responsibility only extends to the person, much as we'd like to think we can somehow control our children, all we can do is our best and then let them go on to be personally responsible for themselves, too.
There are no guarantees that your best or my best or some other parent's best will be good enough, all any of us can do is our best. That's OUR personal responsibility.
At some point, your children will no longer be YOUR responsibility and that's why we can only hope we did a good job and they'll turn out to be the good people we hope(d) they would be.
I'd think it'd be really hard for imperfect people to somehow ALWAYS manage to turn out perfect children (adults).
Even GOD Himself couldn't manage it.
"At some point, your children will no longer be YOUR responsibility and that's why we can only hope we did a good job and they'll turn out to be the good people we hope(d) they would be".
I agree with your complete assessment however ages 16 and 17 are under the complete control of parents, but actions taken before this point usually cause the outcome at this age.
This subject actually came up in my Sunday School class last week, Tom, and I actually took your side of the argument but, before the class was over I was convinced of the error of my ways.
A parent might be able to exercise complete control over a 16 - 17 year old but it's a very rare case when they do. It would demand a parent, or parents, spend 24 hours a day with the teen. How many parents do that, and in reality, I couldn't agree, necessarily, that such action would be best for the teen.
Maintaining such complete control over a teenager, in my opinion, doesn't set them up to do well when they finally reach that golden age of 18(+) and decide to leave the watchful eye of the parent. In my opinion, depending upon the relationship between each individual child and the individual set of parents, such full time control could have a very insulating effect, making it less likely the child, now adult, will do well on his or her own. I have real worries about that.
There are other aspects that trouble me but I don't feel like writing a book, nor do I think I'm qualified to recommend the best way to raise children to other people. I will say, I don't think there is a one size fits all way to raise children.
You like your freedom. Of all the people I know, you seem to value (or at least, champion) your freedom more than just about anyone. The kind of control you are talking about doesn't seem to promote or nurture it in others.
You've done well with your children. Good for you. :)
I brought up God for a reason. God could have chosen to exercise complete control over mankind if He had chosen to. He didn't. He gave mankind free will. I believe He is omnipresent, you aren't required to agree. His omnipresence means He was watching Adam and Eve when they chose to go against his guidance, direction and will for them. He didn't CONTROL them, He didn't take away their free will. He allowed them their freedom. If that isn't a case history that we weren't really meant to have complete control over our children (or ANY other) but were intended to allow them a certain amount of freedom then I can't top it and we'll just have to agree to disagree. I'm comfortable with that.
I will say that God also chose to limit man more than He is limited. We aren't omnipresent.
Silly Tom (said in fun),
You can't keep tabs on a 17-year-old. If a teen is determined to have sex, then he or she will have sex. It goes back as far as The Bible and is human nature.
You can blame parents for not being there, for being neglectful, for abuse, for apathy. But that does not necessarily equate to sex. Christians, Repugs, Dems, it doesn't matter. They tend to want sex some kind of bad.
Managing your home finances is different as you have complete control over that. That is a determinant of fiscal responsibility. But horny teens, desperate to feel like grownups have sex.
I think we can judge Palin by other criteria. If we find that she has been a neglectful parent, that might change things, but we no reason to suspect that.
That's my thought anyway, for whatever its worth. To each his own perspective, eh?
Please feel free to vote against her and McCain and vote for Obama instead. [smile]
Silly Jacke !!!!!
Your misunderstanding what I'm trying to say. As children are growing up you(the parent)set the standards of which said child will be raised.
A child having sex at the age of 17 doesn't occur when that child turns 17 it occurs much sooner say preteen with how that child is raised and other variables. Janine and I are hardly perfect parents but we have kept open the line of communication, we haven't hid anything from our kids and we have even told them of our own faults. Children don't just up and pick up a pack of cigarettes and begin smoking unless there are outside variables which lead into that realm.
My kids have turned out in the manner of which they have because we have been involved parents, we are not only parents to our kids but have a friendship of parenthood with most of their friends. Many times our house is the hang out because the kids have the freedom to do things at our house that there own parents would frown upon like staying up all night playing video games.
Hey, I'm not the one who called you silly but I have seen you act pretty silly a time or two. ;)
I hope you are right and you've been such wonderful parents that your children never, ever, get in trouble or make a bad decision and have to face consequences, though I can think of a lot of worse consequences than having a precious baby, as Palin's daughter will do.
There have been a lot of wonderful parents who did their best, maybe even raising their kids a lot like you and Janine have, who have a child or children who've made mistakes, even though their parents gave it their all.
I'm sure of it, but I want only the best for you and yours...as I would anyone. You have a lot of good reasons to be proud of your children. :)
If my kids at some point do screw up I'll be looking in the mirror trying to determine at which point we as parents messed up, at least until they both turn 18.
Oh wait that has already happened so they can determine the outcome of their own life at this point. My only hope is they ask the question of "what would my parents do?" before doing something stupid.
silly ??? your being much too kind !!
Heh.
I hope they make as good parents as their parents!
GOD no !!! don't wish that on them, we've made every mistake and then some, we have been very fortunate
It's good to know you guys made some mistakes. It verifies what I have long suspected.
THE ONLY PERFECT PARENT IS MOMMA TWOOP. :)
At least she has the common sense to educate her own children instead of allowing the government school system to turn their skulls full of mush into MUSH.
Jacke said: "There are no guarantees that your best or my best or some other parent's best will be good enough, all any of us can do is our best. That's OUR personal responsibility.
At some point, your children will no longer be YOUR responsibility and that's why we can only hope we did a good job and they'll turn out to be the good people we hope(d) they would be."
I agree with you 110%, Jacke. All we, as parents, can do is attempt to lay a strong foundation for our children in their formative years and encourage continued strength in their decision-making and reasoning skills as they age and become more independent.
We also have to give them room to make mistakes and learn from them, a very important aspect of maturing. But it is good to remember that even the best laid foundations are susceptible to outside influences which can weaken or break it. We can only do so much and, short of keeping a teenager hostage in their own home, violating their right to freedom, there is no way to guarantee that your child will not make mistakes as they are influenced by others outside of the family sphere. All we can do as parents is hope that the consquences of the bad decisions made in their teen years will not be too harsh.
My oldest is now 20 years old. When I see the situation the Palin family is facing, along with thousands of other families across this nation, all I can say is, "There, but for the grace of God, go I." OUr family could have easily been in that situation with our oldest. We all know it and are thankful that her bad decisions didn't reap that kind of consequence.
Tom said: "I agree with your complete assessment however ages 16 and 17 are under the complete control of parents, but actions taken before this point usually cause the outcome at this age."
I respectfully disagree with this, Tom. A child is not under the complete control of parents at these ages. Parents are still, hopefully, the major influences in their lives at this stage, but they are not "in control." This is the time that kids begin experiencing more and more freedom - dating, driving, high school, working, etc. Short of spending every minute of every single day with the teen, a parent cannot have complete control and cannot be expected to keep them from making a mistake.
Being the parent of a now-grown teen, I can tell you that they're VERY CREATIVE in finding ways to do whatever it is they want to do. I can also say from my parenting experience and from my experience of having once been a less-than-angelic-teen myself, that parents are usually the last ones to know when/if their teen is engaging in activities we'd rather they not.
Further, there is no way to predict what causes kids to do what they do at this age. Children who have had the best upbringing can, and have, turned out badly. It wasn't their upbringing that caused it, but something else and it isn't always easy to pinpoint the cause. Generally, I think, although I'll be the first to admit I'm no expert, a child going "bad" (for lack of a better term) is the result of a combination of factors. Conversely, children who have had a horrible upbringing can, and have, grown up to become great, upstanding citizens who would make any parent proud...probably not as often as we'd like, but it does happen.
Jack said: "But horny teens, desperate to feel like grownups have sex."
Ain't that the truth!
Tom said: "If my kids at some point do screw up I'll be looking in the mirror trying to determine at which point we as parents messed up, at least until they both turn 18.
I think any parent will look in the mirror and wonder what they did wrong if their child screws up at any age, even as an adult. I think it's human nature to wonder if we couldn't have done something better, don't you?
Jacke said: "THE ONLY PERFECT PARENT IS MOMMA TWOOP. :)
OH, how I wish! LOL Put me in the same category as Tom...we've made our fair share of mistakes and then some. It's a learning process the whole way through!
Thank you for the kind words, Jacke. I've been lucky with mine so far, and I've had a lot of help from family, including my sister in Missouri, who have given me sage advice and prayers when needed.
"Jack said: "But horny teens, desperate to feel like grownups have sex."
Ain't that the truth!
Then I guess my two have yet to get horny !! I guess we are fortunate up to this point that both kids want to further their education and get established before taking the dating step.
Perhaps we are overbearing parents when while dating in the teen years our kids went out on group dates.
In any manner I'm glad our kids don't blend into the norm realm of drinking, sex, and smoking before graduation. This probably also comes from outside sources of which we don't have many, even our kids friends attend the same church.
Tom said: "At least she has the common sense to educate her own children instead of allowing the government school system to turn their skulls full of mush into MUSH.
Thanks, Tom! Home education is an adventure, to say the least. Most school days work out just fine. Occasionally, a day will end with me feeling like a pig pooped on me. :)
Yes, there IS a story behind that sentiment, but I won't bore you with the details. Suffice it to say that in our schooling such crazy things as being besieged by pig poo have happened.
"There, but for the grace of God, go I."
Momma don't sell yourself short with this statement. You have instilled morals and values into your children and they have decided to put off such things as getting pregnant while unwed and the various other problems that teens get into today.
The statement referenced above makes it appear that you just as easily could have a pregnant teen, when in all reality you have taught your children well enough to do what is RIGHT even when they aren't being watched. Far to often this is not the norm. Pat yourself on the back thank Gog if you wish but you deserve the credit for your children making the correct decisions.
Momma don't sell yourself short with this statement. You have instilled morals and values into your children and they have decided to put off such things as getting pregnant while unwed and the various other problems that teens get into today.
Thank you, Tom, but I'm not selling myself short, I assure you. My belief is that parents can instill all the morals and values they like in their children. They can work to see that the family lives in accordance with those morals and values, and stress just how important those morals/values are. However, once a child is older and begins experiencing the freedom which accompanies age, it is the child who will choose how to handle what life throws their way, whether or not the morals/values they've been taught remain top priority in the decisions they make and in their behavior. Unfortunately, many turn away from what they've been taught, or what they know is right, for any number of reasons - the main one being, in my experience, that the teen believes his/her parents are "old-fashioned fuddy-duddies who know nothing about being a teen in 'today's' world." Or, they make bad choices because they think "everyone else is doing it, too, so what's the big deal...." I have been there, experienced all that - both as a parent and a teen!
The statement referenced above makes it appear that you just as easily could have a pregnant teen, when in all reality you have taught your children well enough to do what is RIGHT even when they aren't being watched. Far to often this is not the norm. Pat yourself on the back thank Gog if you wish but you deserve the credit for your children making the correct decisions.
We ARE lucky that we didn't have a pregnant teen in our family, Tom. She chose to act "grown up" when the time came and her little heart just knew this was "The One" she'd spend the rest of her life with, just like millions of teens before her and the millions more to come. We didn't get a surprise grandbaby, but it certainly wasn't because she chose to do what was right when she wasn't being watched. We were lucky and I'm enough of a realist to admit it.
I have a neice whose parents (my in-laws) are great in every imaginable way. She gave birth to a son at the age of 17. While none of them would ever say this boy, who is now 8 y/o, was anything but a blessing, I'm sure they would have rather she waited until she at least finished high school before becoming a mother. This teen, who had a wonderful upbringing and a solid foundation, made a bad choice and had to face the consequences.
Our family would have done the same had we been put in that position, but I'm glad we never had to face that.
All this to say that, yes, we are lucky. Palin's daughter, not so much, though it will be a blessing if they stick together as a family.
There, but for the grace of God, go I.
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